Felix Stalder via Nettime-tmp on Wed, 14 Jun 2023 10:04:24 +0200 (CEST) |
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Re: <nettime> Direction of Travel |
Hi Rich,for me as an barely capable sys-admin, complex infrastructure -- and as you detail so well, mail server have become very complex -- always runs on someone else's computer.
For me, and for nettime since it's inception, the way to deal with this is to operate on social trust (aka friendship), to be able to talk to the sys admin and have a cooperative relationship, so things don't disappear suddenly and if they do, there is a base layer of shared commitments to sort the situation out.
This is why I always said that moderation and sysadmin goes together. It doesn't need to be the same people, but people who trust and communicate each other.
We've had this with kein and Ljudmila, and also with Waag and possibly rhizome. With rise-up, there is a shared value base, not not really personal contacts, which makes me slightly more hesitant.
So, this is both a technical question and a social question. And who the "we" is in the end shapes that.
all the best. Felix On 13.06.23 18:26, Rich Kulawiec via Nettime-tmp wrote:
On Wed, Jun 14, 2023 at 12:02:10AM +1000, paul van der walt via Nettime-tmp wrote:* John Preston will reach out to riseup.net, to ask whether they would be willing and/or able to host a list of our size, * Jordan Crandall knows the executive director of rhizome.org and so will put out feelers in that direction, * Henk said that waag.org would be able to host nettime if we wanted that.These may or may not be good options, but I thought that the idea was to do everything possible to avoid having to revisit this issue in the future -- which is why I didn't volunteer to host the list even though I could have it running on existing infrastructure in a matter of hours. Otherwise: what's the plan when riseup.net (et.al.) go away? (That's not a rhetorical question.) You'll be right back here again. The only way to avoid this inevitability is to run your own domain, mail system, and mailing list -- and to structure it so that it's a lift-and-drop operation to shift it to another host should that need arise. These are baseline skills for any competent sysadmin, so this shouldn't be that hard. There have got to be half a dozen (or more) people here who have this skillset, right? Or who are capable of learning and who are willing to invest the necessary time/effort? Otherwise, all that will happen is shifting and deferring the problem, not solving the problem. And if you want to choose that path: well, it's certainly an option. But that choice will have consequences. ---rsk # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets # more info: https://mail.ljudmila.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nettime-tmp # archive: http://www.nettime.org contact: nettime@kein.org # @nettime_bot tweets mail w/ sender unless #ANON is in Subject:
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