fran ilich on 4 Jul 2000 04:05:47 -0000

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<nettime> ( with X-Ploit (everybody's searchs the net looking for them & nobody
finds them: they're on the presidentīs desktop).

by fran ilich

translated from spanish by lucia

In 1998 the X-Ploit Team started attacking mexican government servers with
several results: most of them simply devastating. Since then, even though
the authorities have been searching for them, they have remained anonymous,
inspiring kids to hacktivate the net, just like they where the
net.counterparts of the Subcomandante Marcos from the zapatistas. In this
chat, X-Ploit talks about the coming presidential elections of july 2, of
political parties and their relation with hackers, and also about the future
of hacktivism in .mx

Start of #ackt buffer: Thu Jun 15 15:50:04 2000
*** Now talking in #ackt
*** guest2267 has joined #ackt
<ilich> hola...
<guest2267> hola
<ilich> how are you?
<guest2267> not everyone could make it because of the time
<ilich> don't worry.... are you leadrain?
<guest2267> no I'm lotek
<guest2267> LoTek
<guest2267> we wouldīve liked an interview in person, but it's risky for us
<ilich> dont worry about me. Im not one of those.
<guest2267> what do you think, in the coming elections several parties want
to hire us and other hackers too
<ilich> tell me about it.... sounds interesting....
<guest2267> yes, pan (right wing party), prd (left wing party), pri (the
usual party), they want to derange their information centers on the 2nd of
<ilich> and what do they offer and ask for exactly?
<guest2267> they offer $$ & information benefits that only political parties
have access to like the election database, in fact I have part of the
database somewhere around here
<ilich> and what have you thought about it?
<guest2267> that we arent on the side of politics
<ilich> i mean, i would have given it a thought...
<guest2267> yeah, but its dangerous, too dangerous. If we get to fuck up
something of the ife (federal electoral institute) they surely wouldn't want
any witnesses
<ilich> ok, & supposing you really did it, which would be your technique? Or
would they also give you open access so you could even do it from the
bosses' desktop?
<guest2267> yeah, direct access to network.. Or access to the machines of
the prep. unstable machines. Unix with accessible backdoors.
<ilich> and tell me, is the government ready this time to manipulate
numbers? I mean technically...
<guest2267> yeah, as usual. The 3 main political parties are trying to hire
hackers. which might mean they truly need help, but who knows? Maybe the pri
(usual party) is only doing it as a cover. Some others already have hackers
working, like the pan (right wing party).
<ilich> is the pan doing this because thet want to manipulate the final
number of the votes or to defend themselves?
<guest2267> leadrain is coming right now, but he wont talk.
<ilich> perfect.
*** LeaDRaiN has joined #ackt
<ilich> hola leadrain....
<LeaDRaiN> HoL@
<guest2267> haha, i wanted to use my nick lotek, but somebody else is using
<LeaDRaiN> these people!!!
<guest2267> there are many persons trying to pass up as x-ploit members on
all networks...
<LeaDRaiN> so what?
<ilich> ok, the millon-dollar question.... who will get elected?
<guest2267> lead, whoīs going to win the elections?
<LeaDRaiN> The TriCoLoR (PRI: usual party) & ther alliance
*** guest2267 is now known as L0Tek
<ilich> electronische fraud?
<LeaDRaiN> the problem is there wont be any fraud, but at the same time they
might use it
<L0Tek> yes
<ilich> so then why would they want to hire hackers? I mean, why, if they
will win anyhow?
<L0Tek> as usual
<LeaDRaiN> The problem of the 3rd of july is the initial quick counting of
the votes, and the first votes to get there are from the cities, which means
that day the pan will be leading
<LeaDRaiN> but at the end the pri will win because its strength its in the
land fields. I hope people wont start fighting each other.
<L0Tek> surely its just a safety measure.
<LeaDRaiN> hackers arenīt needed for the electronic fraud, the only thing
they need is people of theirs at the IFE (federal electoral institute)
<L0Tek> and what the other parties want is to be able to declare the system
unstable, so that the elections will look questionable.
<L0Tek> or in the system that will collect all the info, which is supposed
to be a secret where it will be, but...
<ilich> at what moment are the hackers coming into the scene, in order to
save the world?
<LeaDRaiN> well, i havent been contacted by the bastards XDD
<L0Tek> haha
<LeaDRaiN> ilich, where did you got the idea that they want hackers?
<ilich> lotek suggested it...
<L0Tek> yes lead, in the pan (right wing party)
<LeaDRaiN> we still need the country to be more dependent on systems, in
order for us to really be an important force. our strikes aren't really
important without the help of the press
<L0Tek> -ilich, a week ago on the pan website, they where asking hackers to
get in touch with the webmaster if they wanted to do business.
<LeaDRaiN> L0TeK, and did you send them a mail asking about the business,
XDD I hope so =/
<L0Tek> lead, nope
<L0Tek> and a bro was approached by the prd (left wing party), they wanted
to set him up at the main sales system to capture data.
<ilich> and is the pay any good?
<LeaDRaiN> XD because for a 100 I dont do anything..
<ilich> but a 100 is ridiculous... and for a 1000 it's not worth it.... how
much would you charge to do it? Or simply you wouldnīt do it??
<LeaDRaiN> iīve never charged before, i always do it for the fun. I've never
charged. But the price depends on the risk, right?
<L0Tek> yeah, thatīs it. But even the hacker kids do it just to see their
nickname attached.
<ilich> so, what's the solution the hacktivists have in mind?
<L0Tek> our fight now is from the inside
<ilich> lotek said you arenīt sided with politics in general. so, whats your
line of work?
<LeaDRaiN> Ilich, the fight is done day by day, the problem is we need more
people to fight with the same ideals in mind.
<L0Tek> for some people a 100 usd are really good, because they are 15 year
old kids who will think a 100 dollars to hack a machine are a lot of money.
<LeaDRaiN> but L0TeK, this wouldn't be to hack an old woman's hotmail
account <L0Tek> we arent on the side of any political party.
<ilich> so, whats your motivation? hacktivism for pleasure? Hedo-hacktivism?
or adrena-hacktivism?
<L0Tek> to be able to call the government motherfuckers and let the whole
world know about it. And have them worried about it. if they didn't care
about what we do, they wouldn't even care to legislate this new laws.
<LeaDRaiN> bad legislations, on top of it.
<ilich> at some point I thought you guys where an invention of the
government, a myth created in order to legislate an unknown realm...
<L0Tek> yes, i am cecilia salinas. XDD
<ilich> glad to meet you, cecy... cause i can call you cecy, right? You
know, i never met anyone so "so far beyond"...
<LeaDRaiN> ilich, they didnt legislate.. they just started punishing anyone
who really messes up with the government systems. For instance, the worse
someone can do is to delete info on a government system. I think they
couldnīt stand my formatting their machines the following day, while the
administrator is at the keyboard.
<L0Tek> ...
<ilich> and what are the penalties?
<LeaDRaiN> most of them are fines. But by deleteting we dont even get bail
<L0Tek> somehow we where indeed created by the government, because if this
was a democratic country we wouldn't exist, or we wouldn't do hacktivism.
<ilich> and what do you make of the attitude of the hacker kids?
<LeaDRaiN> there are lots of types of boy scouts... but no hacker kids.
They simply exploit the tools they get. And their mentality is far beyond
that of a hacker. But there is no doubt there are some, they are staring to
<L0Tek> yeah, and in fact they only do it just because.
<ilich> and how all this hacker groups respond to the question of
<L0Tek> it seems a lot of them dont care about hacktivism because people
connect you with other groups.
<LeaDRaiN> and for fear of repression. They just love to upload their name
and whatever other nonsense.
<L0Tek> without any doubt thereīs a lot more responsibility when you do
something against the government, and assume the risk. I think a lot of
people are afraid or simply don't bother.
<ilich> what about the 2600 meetings in mexico?
<LeaDRaiN> they are monthly meetings i have never been to.
<L0Tek> 2600 doesnt have any real presence in mexico, theyīre just wannabes
and hacker kids.
<ilich> and how do you relate to the chiapas conflict?
<L0Tek> its the usual, abuse of power, crushing.
<ilich> tell me which are the hacks you feel most proud of.
<L0Tek> mmm personally, the one to the tributary administration, it was the
first one and the one who created a lot more noise and that's why the
attention got back once again into chiapas and the ezln, world wide. They
thought we were zapatistas. And that was something basic for hacktivism,
both in the country and in the whole world. And I think for lead it must
have been when he destroyed the local network of CNA. haha.
<ilich> national center of the arts??
<L0Tek> national comision of water (agua). When the administrator tried to
hunt us down and only started losing machine by machine
<ilich> ha ha ha ha
<LeaDRaiN> =) i would say the one of INEGI (National Institute of
Stadistics, Geography and Informatics). The next day= everything deleted
<L0Tek> also the one of the senate... each one has its own history
<LeaDRaiN> yeah, each one its history
<L0Tek> in the senate one we entered again after a hack, to re-hack, and the
admin was inside, we deleted everything and the administrator of the senate
was a teacher form the technological university, and he even offered extra
grade scores to their pupils if they catched us
<LeaDRaiN> but since they didnīt catch us.. =)
<L0Tek> but they all tried
<LeaDRaiN> how did he wanted to trap us if we had hundreds of people all
over the net claiming they were us
<L0Tek> that's right...
<LeaDRaiN> later they even hired a firm to catch us and nothing.
<L0Tek> the san pedro page was good as well, it remained hacked for the
whole 16th of september ... but the SSA one was reviewed even in 24 hours,
and they read our manifesto, that was excellent, that they read everything,
it wasn't censored by televisa
<ilich> but why san pedro?
<L0Tek> san pedro sux
<LeaDRaiN> for the "rikitos de monterey"
<ilich> I mean, but why san pedro?
<L0Tek> according to what everyone says because we live in monterrey
<LeaDRaiN> to hurt their pride...
<ilich> wasn't it?
<LeaDRaiN> and the best part was to publish the senators' mails with their
porno web sites and what they spend the money in..
<ilich> orale... tell me about the senators' maikls or send them over..
<L0Tek> then we tried to contact john perry barlow but we never managed
<ilich> say, and what is your relation with other hacktivist groups in the
world? For instance edt? or rtmark? What do you think about their work?
<L0Tek> those groups got in touch with us and are still in touch, ever since
we started hactivism in mexico they were asking for our help to hack
servers, mess up government networks in the whole world, like in east timor.
<LeaDRaiN> on the other hand the motherfuckers never sent so much as a
mail.. to support our cause
<L0Tek> and we would have liked it to meet some other teams in some con, but
it's dangerous, we were threatened
<L0Tek>  and advised by people who supported us and told us there were
people searching for us, names, everything...
<LeaDRaiN> mind you, we never use our nick's on the net
<ilich> of course. Figures.
<LeaDRaiN> that's why every time we see someone who claims to be part of
x-ploit be doublecheck thoroughly..
<L0Tek> we were contacted once by this girl who wrote her thesis on
hacktivism. The fun part is that now they think x-ploit is dead and we're
still getting info, right? We succeeded in one thing, to get many people to
hack servers in big companies or the government, and from all those people
some of them had at least the nerve and the morals to extract non-public
information and make it public, no one was doing anything before, now there
are more groups, though only some of them have reached some maturity, some
<LeaDRaiN> anyway I reached my goal, we got people interested in hacking and
supported a cause.
<L0Tek> yeas, and we would like that more people got together, we would have
liked to give lectures, or something, but it was very dangerous, we were not
playing and the government wasn't playing either, that's why we're never on
the net, we must act carefully to get information
<ilich> and what's the hackers' plan for the elections?
<L0Tek> I know for a fact that there are people tracking us down, and
besides there are many hackers who are being classified for whatever shit
who knows who are they after, there are people working for both sides and
those who are part of the government and pretend to be hackers
<ilich> and how can you tell the ones who work for the government? Why do
they do it? And how much do you think they get?
*** LeaDRaiN has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer )
*** LeaDRaiN has joined #ackt
<L0Tek> because some of them tell you, or they tell people they trust and if
those people are really on the hackers' side and against the government,
they tell you, too much boasting gives them away, actually most of the ones
who get hired are the least discreet, so it's a bad investment, they never
get anyone, only those with no experience
<LeaDRaiN> well, I'll leave you, I must go. duty calls.
<L0Tek> ok lead, see you later
<LeaDRaiN> Ok. Be bad... CIAo
*** LeaDRaiN has quit IRC (Quit: ... )
<ilich> ok.
<ilich> tell me about echelon... do you think it's myth or reality?
<L0Tek> it's reality, proved, we know people who have worked with her,
people form other countries
<ilich> and what do you recommend not to be traced?
<L0Tek> to use mobile positions, change servers, etc... obviously encrypt I
think they use it more for fraud than anything else... I mean for money.
<ilich> what do you think of censorship in mexico?
<L0Tek> censorship still exists in mexico, but thanks to some other opening
chances, like internet or cable tv you can have access to more information.
<ilich> and do you think that "the powers that be" would be interested in
the sort of information someone like you and me can work with?
<L0Tek> it depends on the nature of such information, but if you get
something sensible there ARE people who care. We have contacts at CISEN and
those guys have a lot of equipment, a lot of equipment and intelligence.
Most of them don't know, and don't know there are actually people checking
what you do or say
<L0Tek>     Municipal database System - Sistema Municipal de Base de Datos
<L0Tek>      User :BDEDDF_______60
<L0Tek>     Password:INEGI14257
<L0Tek>   Note: Please type this passsword in capitals and with no spaces;
<L0Tek>  also bear in mind that the User password will always have 15
<L0Tek> The LoTeks constantly monitor "the 500-channel universe," chopping
<L0Tek> network material and spitting it back out as graffiti-broadcast
<L0Tek> meant to shake up a worldwide audience and counter routine
<L0Tek>  1,8-------
<L0Tek> I know you're professional hackers like me, and no amateurs, I
inform you
<L0Tek> that this man
<L0Tek> (, whom I'
<L0Tek> found out doesn't know anything, has the intention of get you
<L0Tek> all, but not because he's a good person, but to get
<L0Tek> some prestige for whoever, regardless of causing you or anyone else
<L0Tek> to collapse. In order to do that he has abused his supposed
<L0Tek> in Monterrey's Technological (where I/he studied sytems)
<L0Tek> I'm sending you the senate mails... just let me get them together
with the e-mail, beepers and cellphones database of the whole senate and
congressmen and their children so that you can publish them if you want to.
Let their information nodes flood. I just received the mails and cells of
cecy salinas, her brothers and those of zedillo. Maybe I speak with a
satanic voice in the morning. shit it's quite big the database...
 wait. You could also publish part of the electoral census so that they
believe we have it
<ilich> ok.... and what about the monitoring system in mx? Do we have any
national echelon?
<L0Tek> the cisen one is very good. not like echelon, but they have good
governmental technology, cisen. They provide the information for SEDENA
<ilich> does everything go to a massive database? And who is considered
worthy to be in the database? What kind of profile are we talking about?
<L0Tek> the epr people, the leaders, ezln, proletarian groups and things
like that. obviously journalists... also intellectuals. I just know they don
't have anything about us, and that they have alot about other hackers,
wannabes. They even have tempest equipment. They spy a lot, all governmental
rooms have microphones and microcameras installed. Now imagine, someone over
there sympathizing with us....
<ilich> and what about the mexican hackers or what was the name again?
<L0Tek> which
<ilich> where altex was, or is, and all of them...
<L0Tek> ah i know, the main ones. Those guys are in the records, some of
<ilich> ah, those.... what about them?
<L0Tek> i've seen them in those info lists. mosh was also there, and
apparently the sedena people were going to fuck him up, but the government
said no
<ilich> and there are others....
<L0Tek> mmm i don't remember all of them, some have even been caught
already. But they don't tell for fear of being kicked off the hacker
community. But it's a big risk.
<ilich> so they are e-spies now?
<L0Tek> do you know where the main site of IFE will be? on the 2nd of july?
<ilich> no, where?
<L0Tek> in the UNAM, in the DGSCA. It's supposed to be a secret. They're
going to close the unam those days and it's going to be watched over by the
army. And there will only be mirrors... public ones
<ilich> and do you expect fraud? Something of the sort? And how do you think
the cgh will react?
<L0Tek> mmm i don't know, but they are going to dress as unam aid people...
i could lend you a CD with valuable information, mail, cellphones and
beepers lists, addresses of the most important politicians, properties
<ilich> of course.... i'd love to have it... it's months since we kept in
<L0Tek> i need to go now, but we'll stay in touch
<ilich> then... bye.
<L0Tek> bye
*** L0Tek has quit IRC (Quit: bye )
End of #ackt buffer    Thu Jun 15 16:49:37 2000

Fran Ilich is the editor of Sputnik
Lotek Y LeadRain are members of the X-Ploit Team.
DES couldn't make it to the chat. He's also a member of X-Ploit.

nos vemos en el futuro.

editor sputnik bits.
co-editor sputnik atomos.

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