franz schaefer on Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:30:55 +0100 (CET)

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Re: <nettime> Google INC. vs Wisdomized Clouds

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 08:51:13PM +0100, Matze Schmidt wrote:

> fabrication + with value -> consuming = fabrication + with even more
> value 
> [..]
> so, couldn't the model be applied to the 'consuming itself' (the concept
> of the prosumer does this in fact)? e.g. bread rolls: i (the consumer)
> am producing value of bread rolls by eating them. consuming would be
> producing ... strange enough.

in the classic marxist sense, the only thing that produces value is "the
worker and soil". (where most of the marxist analysis focuses on the worker
and soil is mostly ignored where it is more important today, as we reach the
limits of the ecosystem... which is still to often ignored in the left

consumation was/is always an essential part of the circulation of capital.
if one produces things with no use-value, things that can not be consumed
loose there value (that is the time of work necessary to produce them is

if we can produce (new) useful things ("side effects")  while we consume
others (necessary things that we would want/need to consume anyway), this
just equates to a raise in general productivity. in the marxist sense it is
no "value" that is produced. a byproduct that comes at no (or almost no)
extra expense (of worktime).

within capitalism: as with any increase in productivity: the capitalists
that can make use of the new technology can earn some elevated profit until
all his/her competitors make use of the new technology....

so much for the classical point of view. nothing new. except that the extra
productivity is created in the realm of consumation and not production. but
this is not so new neiter: e.g. most of the leisure industry uses this for
ages: when i go to a pub i do not want to be alone there: the other guests
"produce" my experience in the pub while i "produce" theirs.. etc..etc..

the interesting questions for us here and now: how much and how long will it
be possible for google and others to hold a monopoly on the new
technologies? will it be possible to move the new technology outside of the
realm of "for profit" entirely? and, as you said, there is the bio-political
side. how it changes our society when ever more aspects of our existence are
subsumed capital....

this are not questions we can answer a priori but that will be determined by
the free tools we produce, by the public awareness we can raise about the
dangers and chances of the new technologies. the answers will be found in
the success or failure in our struggle against capitalism.



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